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#40611 - 05/14/06 10:17 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
ParaDude
Member


Registered: 03/22/00
Posts: 33855
Loc: United Provinces of America
Quote:
Originally posted by flicka:
Quote:
Originally posted by ParaDude:
To suggest otherwise, to suggest society is ok with the killing of a crip is akin to fearmongering...which is what I stated in my first response.
I think the article's focus is on the judge's decision not society as a whole.
So then what is the big deal? One judge, one judge out of how many thousands. If one African American is found hanging in a tree in Maine is it logical for all African American's in Maine to feal fear and oppresion? An isolated case is not something anyone has to get worried about...unless of course your name is Xuxan.
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#40612 - 05/14/06 10:18 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
ParaDude
Member


Registered: 03/22/00
Posts: 33855
Loc: United Provinces of America
Quote:
Originally posted by flicka:
Quote:
Originally posted by ParaDude:
When the AB world hears us complain, hears us demand SPECIAL rights and privileges do you think that sort of thing helps? When that business owner Greg describes is forced to make major renovations to his business all because one crip wants to spend 50 dollars a year in his business, do you think that business owner has a better feeling about crips? I don't think so.
How do you figure access to businesses and bathrooms constitutes SPECIAL rights and privileges. I have no pity for businesses who haven't made an attempt to comply with our ADA law. They've had 16 years.
So don't shop there. Problem solved.
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#40613 - 05/14/06 10:26 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
Greg
Member


Registered: 08/20/05
Posts: 10000
Quote:
Originally posted by flicka:
I don't think facing the fact that society looks at a disabled body as less valuable then a 'normal' fit body makes anyone a victim. It's reality.
I respect your opinions flicka and I thought about this idea last night (i.e. less valuable in society) and you are probably right. But shit, I hate to admit it to myself and try to prove to myself each day that being disabled does not define me, even if it does control me.
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#40614 - 05/14/06 10:27 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
flicka
Member


Registered: 04/06/00
Posts: 24616
Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142
Quote:
Originally posted by ParaDude:
If one African American is found hanging in a tree in Maine is it logical for all African American's in Maine to feal fear and oppresion?
Only if the authorities say "we aren't going to investigate further because the victim is black."

We shouldn't feel fear and oppression, but we should acknowledge and be aware of the fact that attitudes like this judge's do exist.
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"A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#40615 - 05/14/06 10:30 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
flicka
Member


Registered: 04/06/00
Posts: 24616
Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142
Quote:
Originally posted by Greg:
But shit, I hate to admit it to myself and try to prove to myself each day that being disabled does not define me, even if it does control me.
Your disability can only define you if you allow it. You are in control of your definition of yourself. We can't control other people's perception, but we can sway them.
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"A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#40616 - 05/14/06 10:36 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
flicka
Member


Registered: 04/06/00
Posts: 24616
Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142
Quote:
Originally posted by ParaDude:
So don't shop there. Problem solved.
Yep. problem solved. We can't force people to accept us as equals. The law can only force them to treat us as equals.
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"A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#40617 - 05/14/06 10:47 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
ParaDude
Member


Registered: 03/22/00
Posts: 33855
Loc: United Provinces of America
Quote:
Originally posted by flicka:
Quote:
Originally posted by ParaDude:
If one African American is found hanging in a tree in Maine is it logical for all African American's in Maine to feal fear and oppresion?
Only if the authorities say "we aren't going to investigate further because the victim is black."

We shouldn't feel fear and oppression, but we should acknowledge and be aware of the fact that attitudes like this judge's do exist.
Well we don't know if there will be a further investigation or not.

I'll hold off any further comment and wait for Xuxan to explain what the purpose of posting this particular story was. Was it to enlighten us about one ignorant judge? Or was it to try and lead us to believe that this sort of attitude runs rampant in our justice system?
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#40618 - 05/14/06 10:55 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
ParaDude
Member


Registered: 03/22/00
Posts: 33855
Loc: United Provinces of America
Quote:
Originally posted by flicka:
Quote:
Originally posted by ParaDude:
So don't shop there. Problem solved.
Yep. problem solved. We can't force people to accept us as equals. The law can only force them to treat us as equals.
I remember a line on the show "West Wing", a female conservative thought it was rather offensive that a law was actually created to make the fact that women and men are indeed equal.

Do you think a small business owner is going to think better, or worse, about people with disabilities because he was forced to shell out thousands of dollars to upgrade his washroom on the off hand chance that some customer in a wheelchair shows up needing to pee? Where does it end? I've been watching that tv about "little people" and the struggles they face in a world that is built with taller people in mind. They adapt rather than complain. Should we be demanding that every restaurant have a section with a small table, small chairs, and a washroom with step stools up to the toilets? Why not? This family knows the places it can go where the barriers are minimal, the restaurants they do frequent regularily have made adjustments to fit their needs. To demand that others do the same, even tho they may never go there, is doing nothing except breeding ill will towards all "little people".
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#40619 - 05/14/06 11:14 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
Greg
Member


Registered: 08/20/05
Posts: 10000
Quote:
Originally posted by flicka:
Quote:
Originally posted by ParaDude:
So don't shop there. Problem solved.
Yep. problem solved. We can't force people to accept us as equals. The law can only force them to treat us as equals.
Canada does not have the ADA so I use the "Pain In The Ass Aproach". My local, small town bank is not accessable so on days when my kids can't help out I sit outside the bank and call inside with my cell phone. A bank employee comes out and takes my paperwork and does my banking and each time her and I fill out a complaint card.

I ain't sitting at the back of the bus.
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#40620 - 05/14/06 11:40 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
Doug
Member


Registered: 02/24/00
Posts: 4529
Loc: Charleston, SC, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by Greg:
Quote:
Originally posted by flicka:
Quote:
Originally posted by ParaDude:
So don't shop there. Problem solved.
Yep. problem solved. We can't force people to accept us as equals. The law can only force them to treat us as equals.
Canada does not have the ADA so I use the "Pain In The Ass Aproach". My local, small town bank is not accessable so on days when my kids can't help out I sit outside the bank and call inside with my cell phone. A bank employee comes out and takes my paperwork and does my banking and each time her and I fill out a complaint card.

I ain't sitting at the back of the bus.
A bank? That's not some little Mom and Pop operation like a struggling restaurant. If you've made your complaints known to the people in charge, I think it's time to take the next logical step and have a lawyer write them a letter. Trust me, they can afford to obey the law.
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#40621 - 05/14/06 11:47 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
Doug
Member


Registered: 02/24/00
Posts: 4529
Loc: Charleston, SC, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by ParaDude:
Do you think a small business owner is going to think better, or worse, about people with disabilities because he was forced to shell out thousands of dollars to upgrade his washroom on the off hand chance that some customer in a wheelchair shows up needing to pee?
This particular owner has known the laws existed for 16 years. Could he afford $500? If he'd merely set aside $500 each year for the last 16 years he'd now have $8,000 to put toward the remodel. Also, you're making the assumption that during the entire past 16 years, no maintenance work at all has been done on that bathroom which could have included some accessibility. I'm tired of the f***ing excuses. They've had a decade and a half to obey the laws and have refused. It's time to pay.
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#40622 - 05/14/06 11:51 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
Greg
Member


Registered: 08/20/05
Posts: 10000
Quote:
Originally posted by Doug:
Quote:
Originally posted by Greg:
Quote:
Originally posted by flicka:
quote:
Originally posted by ParaDude:
So don't shop there. Problem solved.
Yep. problem solved. We can't force people to accept us as equals. The law can only force them to treat us as equals.
Canada does not have the ADA so I use the "Pain In The Ass Aproach". My local, small town bank is not accessable so on days when my kids can't help out I sit outside the bank and call inside with my cell phone. A bank employee comes out and takes my paperwork and does my banking and each time her and I fill out a complaint card.

I ain't sitting at the back of the bus.
A bank? That's not some little Mom and Pop operation like a struggling restaurant. If you've made your complaints known to the people in charge, I think it's time to take the next logical step and have a lawyer write them a letter. Trust me, they can afford to obey the law.
In Canada, Banks (this one is CIBC) are not all accessable. I live in a small town 20 minutes away from two larger towns with CIBC accessable branches. But some days would rather bank in town so I do my cell phone deal. I suspect they are planning to close this branch as it is one of few without access.

The plus is the girl who comes out and helps me is a hottie, so I have alerior motives.
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#40623 - 05/14/06 11:52 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
ParaDude
Member


Registered: 03/22/00
Posts: 33855
Loc: United Provinces of America

If the business doesn't want my business then I will take it to another that appreciates me.

Greg - I don't know what part of Canada you live in but I have travelled all over Western Canada and have yet to find a bank that isn't accessible, nor have I found a grocery store that isn't accessible, nor any government building, doctor's office, hospital. I'm not they don't exist somewhere, but the idea that you have CHOOSEN use the 1% of all banks in Canada that isn't accessible seems a little strange to me. Any reason why you simply don't try using one of the other 99%?
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#40625 - 05/14/06 11:55 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
Doug
Member


Registered: 02/24/00
Posts: 4529
Loc: Charleston, SC, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by ParaDude:


If the business doesn't want my business then I will take it to another that appreciates me.

That's good. They'll appreciate you in the back of the bus. Enjoy your ride.
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#40626 - 05/14/06 11:56 AM Re: News & Satire - carer murders NZ paralympian gets 7 years
ParaDude
Member


Registered: 03/22/00
Posts: 33855
Loc: United Provinces of America
Quote:
Originally posted by Doug:
Quote:
Originally posted by ParaDude:


If the business doesn't want my business then I will take it to another that appreciates me.

That's good. They'll appreciate you in the back of the bus. Enjoy your ride.
I ride in the front of the bus, it is the business themselves that I put behind me.
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