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#195130 - 11/05/10 05:54 PM Re: "Works" [Re: ævory]
shakey56
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Registered: 03/31/04
Posts: 1889
Loc: where the wild roadrunners roa...
Originally Posted By: ævory
Originally Posted By: ghoti
Originally Posted By: ævory
So do you think you need faith, ghoti?

Do you think everyone needs it (faith) in order to get that drive to be a better person?


Eveeryone has faith in something. Since we all have different life experiences we just see the world differently. I'm just asking whether your faith or ethical philosophy inspires you to take actions in your life.

IMO the passage from Matthew 25 is clearly a mandate from Jesus to his followers that they are required to help those in need. How else can you interpret it?


That is not what I asked you.

I'd like an answer.

But, to go on with my own thoughts, you use 'faith' in a manner of which it is meant to be the driving force in what makes people do good things. Insulting to an atheist or not?

Since you are not an atheist, then if others could answer that, please do.

Ghoti, I am very tired of your never answering directly. One has to come at you over and again with what they want answered. You never do.

You also say in your latest posting that you are just 'asking': does your faith or ethical philosophy inspire you to take actions in your life? yet, the beginning of this thread is not a questioning of others. It is you saying that 'faith' is suppose to inspire (my word is, drive) one to do good deeds to better their lives.

I don't need ronnie to tell us what he does in his life. Do you? I tell ya, the reason I called you and merry an ass is because you, as well as starlightangel have asked and asked him to say. Who cares? What will it prove, anything? And, maybe he doesn't feel comfortable answering, for one reason or another. Is it your call to see that he does?

The only thing this thread does, is say that since you do things which are good for others you exemplify the better person than, say, someone who doesn't post everything they do in life for the benefit of others. And I think I'm smart enough to know how these threads have gone in the past....it's damned if you do and damned if you don't: if ronnie answered you here, it's possible that it would come back to bite him by someone down the road. If he does not answer you, then all the posters with a bug up their butt about him will unanimously agree and post that he is some kind of troll...only here for himself.

You know what you all can do with that kind of attitude. Go ... ... ...yeah, that's right. I've been called a troll by shakey over and again in the past...that shit does not fly. it is extremely weak response to someone with a voice who simply ...for what they believe or think...has Gotton under your skin. Screw that, because we all are alike in that regard.

YOuse do the same things over and over again. Wabi,....you had to know what he did for a living. we all know how it went after that. for allll these years. he's gone now. and you can run the likes of anyone else Off this board with you guys' damned tactics....but just know that THAT is what makes for piss poor participation here.


lol...you have never come close to my skin, much less gotten under it. Don't recall calling you a troll. Care to provide examples?
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#195137 - 11/05/10 10:56 PM Re: "Works" [Re: shakey56]
ghoti
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Registered: 04/06/02
Posts: 8469
Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255
Ronda, you and I are clearly from different planets or something. If you were asking whether someone has to have RELIGIOUS faith to be inspired to help others, then the obvious answer is OF COURSE NOT. Why does that question even have to be answered?

IMO the passage from Matthew that I posted is a clear mandate from Jesus to his followers that they MUST reach out to help the needy. How else can you interpret it?

The purpose of this thread was for people to talk about how their beliefs (religious or not) encourage and inspire them to do things for others. I kick-started it by telling about what I personally oo. I was hoping we could talk about some positive things and get off the circular arguments that keep going on here.

Instead, everyone stonewalls the issue except Merry and Ronnie calls me insane. Wonderful Christian behavior, folks!

I don't know why I even bother wasting my time talking to everyone around here. Gandhi was absolutely right.
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#195166 - 11/07/10 06:02 AM Re: "Works" [Re: ghoti]
ævory
Member


Registered: 04/04/05
Posts: 9657
Originally Posted By: ghoti


What sort of "works" are you inspired to do by your faith or ethical philosophy?


What a little rebel Darwin was! I wonder, if he hadn't had a mouthful of silver spoons at the age of 3, just what would of empowered him ..you know, what could his driving force in life have been if he'd been of poor common folk like you and me, and what would he have grown up to Be. Some of us just don't have all the advantages that fella had. Wow...makes ya think about driving forces, huh?

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#195167 - 11/07/10 06:05 AM Re: "Works" [Re: ghoti]
ævory
Member


Registered: 04/04/05
Posts: 9657
Originally Posted By: ghoti
Ronda, you and I are clearly from different planets or something. If you were asking whether someone has to have RELIGIOUS faith to be inspired to help others, then the obvious answer is OF COURSE NOT. Why does that question even have to be answered?

IMO the passage from Matthew that I posted is a clear mandate from Jesus to his followers that they MUST reach out to help the needy. How else can you interpret it?

The purpose of this thread was for people to talk about how their beliefs (religious or not) encourage and inspire them to do things for others. I kick-started it by telling about what I personally oo. I was hoping we could talk about some positive things and get off the circular arguments that keep going on here.

Instead, everyone stonewalls the issue except Merry and Ronnie calls me insane. Wonderful Christian behavior, folks!

I don't know why I even bother wasting my time talking to everyone around here. Gandhi was absolutely right.


Why didn't you just put it up on the General Forum then so all could respond?

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#195168 - 11/07/10 06:06 AM Re: "Works" [Re: ævory]
ævory
Member


Registered: 04/04/05
Posts: 9657
I think you have to expect certain things of yourself before you can Do..for others. Does that take faith? How do you define faith? Most the things I do for others just happen automatically because it's ingrained and just...what it is.

Edited by ævory (11/07/10 06:07 AM)

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#195170 - 11/07/10 07:44 AM Re: "Works" [Re: ævory]
Deo
Member


Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 127
Altruistic behavior evolved as one method of interaction of non related individuals within a group. The origins of this behavior had nothing to do with faith in a deity but survival. If faith compels you to be altruistic then thats great.

aevory could you explain your apparent distaste for Darwin.
Deo

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#195182 - 11/08/10 05:41 AM Re: "Works" [Re: Deo]
ævory
Member


Registered: 04/04/05
Posts: 9657
Nice to have a little troll in your pocket, huh, ghoti.
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#195187 - 11/08/10 09:32 AM Re: "Works" [Re: ævory]
ghoti
Member


Registered: 04/06/02
Posts: 8469
Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255
Deo is hardly a troll. He's a wheelchair user who lives in Trinidad and is employed in doing agricultural research. He also happens to be an atheist, which means he and I disagree on the existence of a creator.

If there's a troll around here it's Ronnie. He's a man of mystery - we know nothing about him other than that his extreme inflexible opinions got him banned from a Christian discussion board before he showed up here.

The only thing that unites those of us opposed to extremists like Ronnie is tolerance. We actually have widely differing spiritual views but are able to be comfortable with our own beliefs without the obsession to condemn all others who disagree.

Spirituality is an extremely personal and sensitive subject, and it's nearly impossible to discuss it without mutual respect.
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Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.

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#195189 - 11/08/10 11:02 AM Re: "Works" [Re: ghoti]
Deo
Member


Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 127
Good grief, I wasn't aware I was defending anyone's position. I am very interested in everyone's position once it appears to have a hint of rationality.
There seems to be a correlation between Darwin, evolution and evil. I don't get it as it appears to be an American phenomenon and strangly enough an islamic one also. Could aevory, Ronnie and Paulwa enlighten me please. I have asked this question before. Thanks.
Deo

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#195193 - 11/08/10 11:51 AM Re: "Works" [Re: Deo]
ghoti
Member


Registered: 04/06/02
Posts: 8469
Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255
Deo, we've been going around on this topic for years here. Fundamentalist Christians believe the world is only 6000 years old, and they base this on a calculation by Archbishop Ussher made several hundred years ago.

He took the idea of the earth being created in 7 literal days and then added up the ages given for all the Biblical patriarchs to arrive at this number. Biblical literalists also believe humans and all other life was created by God exactly as they are today, and therefore reject the idea of the evolution of species.

This idea was held by only a tiny minority a generation or so ago, but the "marriage" between politics and religion that has been going on in the US for 30 years or so has resulted in that notion being embraced publicly by many politicians. That plus an aggressive propaganda campaign has made rejection of natural selection much more wide-spread.

They quite literally see acceptance of natural selection to be anti-religion and attack it with all the fervor of the Spanish Inquisition.
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Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.

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#195228 - 11/09/10 02:47 PM Re: "Works" [Re: ghoti]
Paulwa_dup1
Member


Registered: 02/12/05
Posts: 4951
Loc: Washington
All Bishop Usher did Ghoti was to read the bible and come to a logical conclusion that many others probably came to long before his time. You anti biblers always like to find some person to hang your arguments on for some reason and rule out anyone elses intelligence on the same subject. Some of these people you find you try to make look as if they were fools for findng logic in the word of God, well you will find that logic was perfectly true one day soon and you may wish you had paid more attention to them.
Paul

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#195237 - 11/10/10 12:51 AM Re: "Works" [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti
Member


Registered: 04/06/02
Posts: 8469
Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255
There's nothing new about using a narrow inerpretation of a Bible passage to try to deny the findings of science. It's been going on since the dark ages, and it's been a major force in holding back scientific advancement.

Every single time it's happened in the past, the scientific evidence eventually became so overwhelming that even the most adamant Biblical literalist has eventually given up and accepted it. It happened with the concept of whether the sun and stars went around the earth or vice versa, it happened over whether the earth was flat or round, and now it's happening over the age of the earth.

Sooner or later literalists will finally give up their futile cause and accept that the earth is much older than 6000 years, too. It's just a matter of how long certain people will continue to cling to an obvious misinterpretation of the Bible in the face of steadily mounting proof that they are wrong.


Edited by ghoti (11/10/10 12:52 AM)
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Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.

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#195238 - 11/10/10 06:56 AM Re: "Works" [Re: ghoti]
ronniechoate34
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Registered: 02/06/10
Posts: 540
Loc: tennerida
Ghoti,,,, !
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#195240 - 11/10/10 10:33 AM Re: "Works" [Re: ronniechoate34]
ghoti
Member


Registered: 04/06/02
Posts: 8469
Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255
Ronnie, the Big Bang Theory says that the universe was created all at once by some unknown force and everything has developed magnificently from that event. Since science may never find the driving force behind the Big Bang, IMO it's strong evidence of the hand of a creator directing and orchestrating it.

The scientific view of creation is in close agreement with Genesis as long as you are willing to believe that a "day" to God might not mean the same as a day to us. Once you accept that basic concept all the conflict disappears.
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Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.

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#195241 - 11/10/10 11:45 AM Re: "Works" [Re: ghoti]
ronniechoate34
Member


Registered: 02/06/10
Posts: 540
Loc: tennerida
The Bible means what it says and it says what it means.


Genesis:1:5: And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.


Edited by ronniechoate34 (11/10/10 11:46 AM)

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