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#194757 - 10/28/10 06:46 AM Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person
ævory ævory Member Registered: 04/04/05 Posts: 9657	...in his personal life: Marriage and children Darwin in 1842 with his eldest son, William Erasmus Darwin.On 29 January 1839, Darwin married his cousin Emma Wedgwood at Maer in an Anglican ceremony arranged to also suit the Unitarians. After first living in Gower Street, London, the couple moved on 17 September 1842 to Down House in Downe. The Darwins had ten children, three of whom died early. Many of his surviving children and their grandchildren would later achieve notability themselves (see Darwin — Wedgwood family) Several of their children suffered illness or weaknesses, and Charles Darwin's fear that this might be due to the closeness of his and Emma's lineage was expressed in his writings on the ill effects of inbreeding and advantages of crossing. http://www.makara.us/04mdr/01writing/03tg/bios/Darwin.htm -fascinating link there-
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#194758 - 10/28/10 06:56 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Pe [Re: ævory]
ævory ævory Member Registered: 04/04/05 Posts: 9657	What a little rebel he was! I wonder, if he hadn't had a mouthful of silver spoons at the age of 3, just what would of empowered him ..you know, what could his driving force in life have been if he'd been of poor common folk like you and me, and what would he have grown up to Be. Some of us just don't have all the advantages of upbreeding and imbreeding (oops, ..inbreeding....which reminds me to post a link about spelling). http://www.misspelledkeywords.com/download2838/Poor_Spellers_Dictionary.pdf Edited by ævory (10/28/10 06:57 AM)
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#194759 - 10/28/10 07:11 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Pe [Re: ævory]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Nope, he couldn't have been too smart. But he did have one thing going for him and that was that not even he was convinced that his foolishness had any substance to it.
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#194763 - 10/28/10 10:03 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Pe [Re: ronniechoate34]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Darwin was far from alone in developing a theory of natural selection. Many others were reaching similar conclusions at the time, and he just happened to be the first to publish. If Darwin had never been born it would have just been someone else. Natural selection can be observed routinely as simply the way that nature operates (the strong survive while the weak perish). Even the most ardent creationists accept that. Once the evidence mounted that the world was billions of years old rather than just thousands, it's clear that small changes brought about by natural selection can easily add up to the development of entirely new species. All it takes is for millions of years to pass. Since life has existed on earth for something like 3.5 billion years and massive changes in climate and environment have occurred over that time, it's a good thing plants and animals have been so adaptable. _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#194770 - 10/28/10 12:26 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Pe [Re: ghoti]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Nope, not even darwin was convinced.
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#194776 - 10/28/10 12:58 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Pe [Re: ronniechoate34]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	At the time Darwin married his cousin, that was fairly common practice. Arranged marriages were the norm for most of human history - still are in a large part of the world. Study the history of royality in Europe - talk about inbreeding! Darwin was a man of his times. I remember in jr high and high school being told to learn about evolution to pass the tests but don't believe it. LOL I learned and I believe - in evolution AND I remain a Christian. Theology and science are not enemies. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#194778 - 10/28/10 01:00 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Pe [Re: ronniechoate34]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	The only doubts Darwin ever had about his theory were centered around the controversy he knew would develop over it. England at that time was very tightly controlled by an extremely conservative branch of the Church of England, and he knew he would be accused of blasphemy and heresy. He originally intended to have his work published after his death, but others were writing papers hinting that they were about to come to the same conclusions. He finally gave in to pressures from friends and agreed to allow it to go to print so he could get credit for precedence. Even if he had totally withheld from ever publishing his work, the theory of natural selection would have been presented by someone else within a very short time. _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#194780 - 10/28/10 01:14 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Pe [Re: ghoti]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	Yes because man is not the author of evolution, satan is the author, just as the bible is not authored by man but by God as He wrote through the fingers of mankind.
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#194781 - 10/28/10 01:29 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Pe [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	I happen to believe that natural selection is God's plan for seeing that the life he created would manage to survive in an often hostile and constantly changing world. It's actually very brilliant in its elegant simplicity. If not for Archbishop Ussher and his silly 6000 year timeline pretty much everyone would accept natural selection, since we can clearly see it in action today. _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#194788 - 10/28/10 01:57 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Pe [Re: MerryA]
ævory ævory Member Registered: 04/04/05 Posts: 9657	Originally Posted By: MerryA At the time Darwin married his cousin, that was fairly common practice. Arranged marriages were the norm for most of human history - still are in a large part of the world. Study the history of royality in Europe - talk about inbreeding! Darwin was a man of his times. I remember in jr high and high school being told to learn about evolution to pass the tests but don't believe it. LOL I learned and I believe - in evolution AND I remain a Christian. Theology and science are not enemies. I'm not your enemy either merrymagnificent. I love you, 'specially when you try to imitate avorytalk.
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#194789 - 10/28/10 02:02 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Pe [Re: ghoti]
ævory ævory Member Registered: 04/04/05 Posts: 9657	Originally Posted By: ghoti If not for Archbishop Ussher and his silly 6000 year timeline pretty much everyone would accept natural selection, since we can clearly see it in action today. fact?
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#194792 - 10/28/10 02:21 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Pe [Re: ævory]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Insects evolving new forms that are resistant to pesticides, bacteria changing into entirely new immune species in response to our antibiotics, plants being altered into new forms that never existed in nature by genetic engineering, plants and animals being drastically altered over time by selective breeding, etc., etc. All proof that natural (or human directed) selection can cause drastic changes in plants and animals. _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#194939 - 11/01/10 01:36 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ævory]
starlight.2 starlight.2 Member Registered: 02/19/09 Posts: 796	Originally Posted By: ævory Several of their children suffered illness or weaknesses, and Charles Darwin's fear that this might be due to the closeness of his and Emma's lineage was expressed in his writings on the ill effects of inbreeding and advantages of crossing. not to mention that having 10 children in the 19th century with nonexistent specialized perinatal care would have almost certainly have carried a greater risk of health problems. _________________________ Where ignorance is our master, there is no possibility of real peace. --Dalai Lama
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#194941 - 11/01/10 05:36 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: starlight.2]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	Arcbishop so and so is not the author of the 6000 year timeline, except maybe in the Catholic church, Ghoti, the bible is the author of that and is clear to those who study God's word. Anti biblers will grasp at any straw to uphold their view. Paul
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#194942 - 11/01/10 07:38 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	And only those blind to reason would limit God Paulwa. You don't know how long creation took - you don't know how long a day is to God. I am not an "anti bibler" - evolution is a fact. The Catholic Church is responsible for collecting and preserving the Scriptures. Christianity would not exist if it weren't for the Catholic Church. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#194943 - 11/01/10 09:24 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	That is just your myopic opinion and view merryA.
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#194944 - 11/02/10 06:01 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Ussher was an Anglican, not Catholic. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ussher_chronology _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#194963 - 11/02/10 01:10 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
Deo Deo Member Registered: 02/11/08 Posts: 127	Paulwa, I just don't get it. The theory of evolution is an explanation of a natural process, just like the theory of gravity. Why attribute an explanation of a natural process to the devil? I have asked before-do you attribute acceptance of this theory with the loss of morality. Deo
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#194965 - 11/02/10 01:23 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Deo]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	I believe accepting evilution counters the truth of God's word making God a liar. Scientific study of man's history and population and generations places mankind at being on this earth about 6,000 years. I believe this and that does not leave any time for the millons of years of so called evilution. Paul
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#194969 - 11/02/10 02:22 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 Scientific study of man's history and population and generations places mankind at being on this earth about 6,000 years. What scientific study has determined this timeline? _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#194971 - 11/02/10 03:12 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 I believe accepting evilution counters the truth of God's word making God a liar. Scientific study of man's history and population and generations places mankind at being on this earth about 6,000 years. I believe this and that does not leave any time for the millons of years of so called evilution. Paul If Archbishop Ussher was mistaken and the word "day" in Genesis I is not meant to be taken literally, then there is no serious conflict between the Bible and natural selection. There is a VAST amount of scientific evidence proving the earth is about 4.5 billion years old, and the young-earth creationists just ignore it and cling to a bunch of calculations done by a theologan hundreds of years ago instead. The harm being done to science education over this single issue is outrageous. No wonder we're falling behind other countries. _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#194972 - 11/02/10 03:52 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ghoti]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	We don't know the age of the earth but we know mankind began 6,000 years ago. Evilutionists disregard the bibles words. If the bible is right (christians know it is) we will know it soon enough and the earth will glow from the red embarrassed faces of evilutionists facing the creator first hand. Paul
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#194973 - 11/02/10 03:54 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	A group of chrstians who are scientists, Flicka and also firm believers iin the word of God.
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#194976 - 11/02/10 04:16 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 A group of chrstians who are scientists, Flicka and also firm believers iin the word of God. I firmly believe that with God one day is a thousand years, and a thousand years are one day...meaning we have no clue as to timelines. _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#194986 - 11/02/10 06:49 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Yes, no clue, except that the evening and the morning were the first day. How mysterious is that? Genesis:1:5: And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
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#194988 - 11/02/10 07:07 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Genesis 1 1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. ---- It is possible that there was billions of years before God separated light from darkness. Prior to that time, there would not be days & nights. _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#194990 - 11/02/10 07:30 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	That's a pretty far stretch. Genesis:1:1: In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Genesis:1:2: And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. Genesis:1:3: And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. Genesis:1:4: And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. Genesis:1:5: And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
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#194993 - 11/02/10 08:02 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Ronnie, a day is defined as the time it takes the earth to make one rotation on its axis. That takes 24 hours right now, but it's actually changing gradually by a few millionths of a second every day as the gravity pull of the moon and the planets tugs on the earth. Even now, the definition of "day" isn't a fixed thing. God didn't create the earth until the third day, so for days one and two the was no rotating earth to define the term. In other words, "days" didn't exist until day 3 of creation. Isn't it obvious that the word "day" as used in Genesis just means some undetermined length of time? Edited by ghoti (11/02/10 08:03 PM) _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#194994 - 11/02/10 08:24 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 That's a pretty far stretch. All things are possible with God. I believe this notion fits very well with evolution. I cannot deny the evidence of evolution on a micro basis, so I'm sure it happens macro also. Of course, Nature is pretty awesome too. Look at the power behind water and how it has carved canyons & such. It's all amazingly orchestrated. Edited by flicka (11/02/10 08:26 PM) _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#194996 - 11/02/10 08:50 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Evolution, the formation and wearing away of mountains, genetics, DNA, the movement of the planets and organization of stars into galaxies, the structure of cells, the way chemicals interact to form new substances, are all signs to us of the true glory of creation. The way these things all interact with each other to form a smoothly functioning universe is the greatest miracle of them all IMO. If you took your nose out of that old book and just looked around you, the evidence of God is everywhere. _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#194997 - 11/02/10 08:53 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ghoti]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida
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#194998 - 11/02/10 09:56 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	Me too, Ronnie
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#194999 - 11/02/10 10:13 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Look, if you guys want to obsess over the Bible that's fine by me, but don't try to tell me it's the only place you can find God. He's everywhere - all you have to do is keep your mind and eyes open. _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195000 - 11/02/10 10:39 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 Evilutionists disregard the bibles words. I don't. I think what I suggested is completely possible and doesn't disregard a word of the Genesis account. Also, like both ghoti and I pointed out...until God decided to separate light & dark, there was no such thing as a "day". _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195022 - 11/03/10 02:13 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	The day was set in stone pretty much when man was created.6,000 years ago. Paul
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#195024 - 11/03/10 02:58 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 The day was set in stone pretty much when man was created. Actually it was 5 days prior to man's creation, but it wasn't set in stone. _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195027 - 11/03/10 03:37 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	The written record of human civilization in the middle-east may only go back about 6000 years, but cave paintings, archaeoligy, and the fossil record show clear evidence of humans existing far earlier than 6000 years ago in other parts of the world. http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/episode/the-human-family-tree-3706/time-line http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_human_evolution_fossils http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/ http://uts.cc.utexas.edu/~bramblet/ant301/twelve.html#anchor1159394 _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195055 - 11/04/10 11:35 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
starlight.2 starlight.2 Member Registered: 02/19/09 Posts: 796	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 A group of chrstians who are scientists, Flicka and also firm believers iin the word of God. what are their names and where are they published? _________________________ Where ignorance is our master, there is no possibility of real peace. --Dalai Lama
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#195057 - 11/04/10 12:16 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: starlight.2]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	Sorry Flicka I didn't take notes but just drawn from hours of reading and watching documentaries. I watch and read things for myself and not to persuade others..I figure they should know these things if they have any interest in them at all. You are attracted to what interests you personally. Sorry just passing on what I believe and is not intended to persuade anyone, it is just my statement of what I perceive as fact. I don't know if the dating methods used on early man is coirrect and may have flawed interpretation, Ghoti for the fact that in the beginning Carbon 14 mnay have been totaslly different back then due to the water vapor canopy surrounding earth skewing the results. Archaeologist dating methods are far from accurate and are only educated guesses. Paul
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#195060 - 11/04/10 01:31 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Another science lesson from Paulwa LOL I am a firm believer in the word of God and I believe in science AND evolution - micro and macro. God created it all - don't limit God. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195061 - 11/04/10 01:50 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Originally Posted By: MerryA Another science lesson from Paulwa LOL I am a firm believer in the word of God and I believe in science AND evolution - micro and macro. God created it all - don't limit God. Wait, is it okay to limit God if you just can't believe that God created the world and everything in it in under seven days? How about if you don't believe that God spoke this all into existence, can you limit God then? Edited by ronniechoate34 (11/04/10 01:54 PM)
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#195063 - 11/04/10 02:16 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Wait, is it okay to limit God if you just can't believe that God created the world and everything in it in under seven days? How about if you don't believe that God spoke this all into existence, can you limit God then? I can believe that God could create our world & everything in it in under seven days. I just don't think that's the way it happened. I do believe that God spoke this all into existence. One can accept evolution & creation. It's really simple. Edited by flicka (11/04/10 02:17 PM) _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195064 - 11/04/10 02:23 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Originally Posted By: flicka Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Wait, is it okay to limit God if you just can't believe that God created the world and everything in it in under seven days? How about if you don't believe that God spoke this all into existence, can you limit God then? I can believe that God could create our world & everything in it in under seven days. I just don't think that's the way it happened. I do believe that God spoke this all into existence. One can accept evolution & creation. It's really simple. Revelation:21:7: He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. Revelation:21:8: But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
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#195065 - 11/04/10 03:11 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Originally Posted By: MerryA Another science lesson from Paulwa LOL I am a firm believer in the word of God and I believe in science AND evolution - micro and macro. God created it all - don't limit God. Wait, is it okay to limit God if you just can't believe that God created the world and everything in it in under seven days? How about if you don't believe that God spoke this all into existence, can you limit God then? I do believe God spoke all into existence, I just don't believe it happened over a span of man's definition of a day. There is nothing that tells us how long a "day" is to God. You are taking away from the Word when you insist a God "day" is 24 man hours. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195067 - 11/04/10 04:28 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Originally Posted By: flicka I can believe that God could create our world & everything in it in under seven days. I just don't think that's the way it happened. I do believe that God spoke this all into existence. One can accept evolution & creation. It's really simple. Revelation:21:7: He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. Revelation:21:8: But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. What does his have to do with me, Ronnie? _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195070 - 11/04/10 05:32 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	When you discount the Bible as the truth of God then you run the risk of not believing in the Word of God.
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#195071 - 11/04/10 06:15 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 When you discount the Bible as the truth of God then you run the risk of not believing in the Word of God. Where have I done that? At any rate, even if I did discount the truth of the Bible, but believed that Christ sacrificed himself for my salvation, would I still be doomed for the lake of fire? _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195072 - 11/04/10 07:08 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	By believing in evolution you've made the Word of God null and void. This is simple stuff and I shouldn't have to point it out to you. It proves just how far gone you are.
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#195073 - 11/04/10 07:30 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	By not believing in evolution you've made the Word of God null and void. This is simple stuff and we shouldn't have to point it out to you. It proves just how far gone you are. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195074 - 11/04/10 07:57 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Genesis:2:7: And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul. Genesis:2:19: And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof. Genesis:2:21: And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof; Genesis:2:22: And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
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#195075 - 11/04/10 08:00 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	There's no evolution mentioned in any of those passages, and to believe in evolution clearly denies Genesis 2:21-22. There's your unbelief right there flicka.
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#195076 - 11/04/10 08:00 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 This is simple stuff and I shouldn't have to point it out to you. If I believe Christ died for my salvation, am I still going to hell for thinking there was an unspecified amount of time after God created the heavens & earth, but before he separated light from dark and created man? _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195077 - 11/04/10 08:02 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	MerryA you are an ignoramus and will be straightened out one day..Flicka if you discount any of the bible as the word of God you are in error and in danger. Many will conme to Jesus saying but lord we have even cast out demons in your name, but He will say depart from me, I never knew you. Jesus is called the WORD and to pick and choose which of those words you will agree with or toss out puts you in grevious error and danger. Satan goes over the earth as a raging lion looking for those he can devour, espevcially in these last days when he knows his time is growing very short. Evilution is a fools faith and denies God and His truths. Paul
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#195081 - 11/04/10 09:29 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 Many will conme to Jesus saying but lord we have even cast out demons in your name, but He will say depart from me, I never knew you. I will never pretend to speak for Jesus Christ, nor pretend to know who He has saved with His grace. I feel confident my Redeemer lives. _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195082 - 11/04/10 09:40 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 Jesus is called the WORD and to pick and choose which of those words you will agree with or toss out puts you in grevious error and danger. What happens if you read something into it that isn't there? Perhaps you interpret it incorrectly? For example: You believe that the "Beginning" and the first "day" are not within the same 24 hour period, or you believe that the "second coming" will be the end of the world and there will not be a "pretribulation rapture". Hell bound? _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195083 - 11/04/10 09:47 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 ...and to believe in evolution clearly denies Genesis 2:21-22. There's your unbelief right there flicka. I believe God created separate genders. I believe being fruitful & multiplying was part of His plan. Obviously, we are all made from the same material. Science has proven that. _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195084 - 11/04/10 10:22 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	I don't think so Flicka if you do what salvation requires which is repenting and accepting the Lord as your saviour, misunderstanding the scriptures is something rampant in this world and I don't think that is something God holds against us, we just reap what we sow. I do think rejecting some scriptures and saying they are not inspired of God can be dangerous to a person because it degrades the bible and faith in it as Gods word to man. I think all scriptures are God inspired or they would not have stood the test of the ages. Paul
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#195085 - 11/05/10 05:08 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 MerryA you are an ignoramus No I'm not. No where, to my knowledge, does it say I have to believe every word in the Bible to be saved. No where, to my knowledge, does it say that grace is granted only if I believe every word in the Bible. Jesus is not the Bible. Only a fool denies the works of God as shown through his gifts of science. Edited by MerryA (11/05/10 05:09 AM) _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195086 - 11/05/10 05:10 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 to believe in evolution clearly denies Genesis 2:21-22. Wrong. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195087 - 11/05/10 05:14 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
ævory ævory Member Registered: 04/04/05 Posts: 9657	Originally Posted By: flicka Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 Many will conme to Jesus saying but lord we have even cast out demons in your name, but He will say depart from me, I never knew you. I will never pretend to speak for Jesus Christ, nor pretend to know who He has saved with His grace. I feel confident my Redeemer lives. Are you saying paulwa is speaking for Him? I've read the same in the Bible. So have you. I don't understand this.
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#195093 - 11/05/10 06:34 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Originally Posted By: flicka Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 This is simple stuff and I shouldn't have to point it out to you. If I believe Christ died for my salvation, am I still going to hell for thinking there was an unspecified amount of time after God created the heavens & earth, but before he separated light from dark and created man? I don't know about your going to hell, I don't see that far off and I don't hold your salvation in my hands. I do knkow that you're wrong to belive in evolution and unless you repent of that you will have to answer to God for it some day.
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#195095 - 11/05/10 06:44 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Originally Posted By: MerryA Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 MerryA you are an ignoramus No I'm not. No where, to my knowledge, does it say I have to believe every word in the Bible to be saved. No where, to my knowledge, does it say that grace is granted only if I believe every word in the Bible. Jesus is not the Bible. Only a fool denies the works of God as shown through his gifts of science. I don't remember reading anything in the Bible about God's gifts of science. I read about spiritual gifts and I did see that it mentioned one particular gift as plural while the rest were singularly pronounced. That gift was healing, it was written as gifts of healing. But I don't recall one mention of any gifts of science.
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#195096 - 11/05/10 07:04 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
corlorde corlorde Member Registered: 04/24/01 Posts: 9246	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 I don't remember reading anything in the Bible about God's gifts of science. Fair enough, I get your regimented views. Not to change topics, but in your "vast" knowledge of the bible, do you remember Leviticus 20:13 where it says: "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death. Their bloodguiltiness is upon them." Have you started killing yet? And if you haven't, aren't you going against the will of your version of God? Edited by corlorde (11/05/10 07:06 AM) _________________________
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#195098 - 11/05/10 10:44 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ævory]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: ævory Originally Posted By: flicka Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 Many will conme to Jesus saying but lord we have even cast out demons in your name, but He will say depart from me, I never knew you. I will never pretend to speak for Jesus Christ, nor pretend to know who He has saved with His grace. I feel confident my Redeemer lives. Are you saying paulwa is speaking for Him? I've read the same in the Bible. So have you. I don't understand this. I meant I will never pretend to cast out demons (or somesuch) in His name. _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195099 - 11/05/10 10:47 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 I don't know about your going to hell, I don't see that far off and I don't hold your salvation in my hands. I do knkow that you're wrong to belive in evolution and unless you repent of that you will have to answer to God for it some day. Maybe you will have to explain why you ignored ancient fossils & such. _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195106 - 11/05/10 12:06 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	A lot depends on point of view Flicka but ancient fossils are not that old in my view because I believe from what I have heard that Carbon 14 was not the constant science believes it was thus skewing and making much of those measurements null and void. The water vapor canopy spoken of in the bible was disapated during the worldwide flood changing it. The protection of that canopy from dangerous energy rays from space also is believed to have caused the extra life length of the old testament peoples. Correy I don't think God put it on individuals to judge and kill homosexuals. Back in those early days leaders were the judge and jury to exterminate those deviants who were non productive and unfruitful. They are an obomination to God but all sinners are an obamination to God. Rules for ancient Israel were very different and all gentiles are not involved in the rules given in the first covenant to Israel. Christians are under Jesus covenant of grace also known as the second covenant of the bible. In my view MerryA you are ignorant of what God is telling us in His Word. Jesus is the Word and the bible is the Word, thus one point you are ignorant on amongst many. Paul
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#195109 - 11/05/10 12:25 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 In my view MerryA you are ignorant of what God is telling us in His Word. Jesus is the Word and the bible is the Word, thus one point you are ignorant on amongst many. Paul Wrong again. I am not aware of any Scripture that says the Bible and Jesus are the same. The Bible and Jesus are not the same. Give me specific scripture that says they are the same and not just your opinion. Just because I disagree with you (and you know in your heart I'm right) doesn't make me ignorant. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195110 - 11/05/10 12:27 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Paulwa, scientists are very aware of any variations in carbon 14 and take them into account when using it to determine the age of fossils. There are also many other methods of determining age, and they have been tested and are accepted as valid by 99% of the scientific community. http://www.actionbioscience.org/evolution/benton.html http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/dating.html _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195122 - 11/05/10 05:11 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ghoti]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	Don't think they are half aware, Ghoti of the magnitude of change in carbion 14 and as far as other dating pasrameters..pinpointing dates by their level of appearance in the earth and other artifacts found near them is just as tenuous and far from accurate and the reasonm for the 99 percent consensus is just that none of them have a real clue so they set artificial points of agreement they canm all live with. They are all wrong if they don't follow the bibles words. IMO! MerryA Jesus says He is the Word in the bible and the Word was with God and the Word is God and the bible is Gods Word where do you draw the line that Jesus was not the word????? Yep ignorant as a green gourd she is! :-) Paul
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#195128 - 11/05/10 05:44 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Where does it say the the Bible is the same as Jesus? You are assuming that the Bible is the "Word." WHERE does it say that Jesus is the Bible? Don't add to Scriptures. Jesus is not the Bible. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195129 - 11/05/10 05:46 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	MerryA go your way if you don't see it..nothing I can say will get through to you. Have a happy life. Paul
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#195136 - 11/05/10 09:42 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 MerryA go your way if you don't see it..nothing I can say will get through to you. Have a happy life. Paul So in other words, there is no Scripture that says Jesus is the Bible. BTW - Ditto _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195146 - 11/06/10 12:11 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
starlight.2 starlight.2 Member Registered: 02/19/09 Posts: 796	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 Don't think they are half aware, Ghoti of the magnitude of change in carbion 14 and as far as other dating pasrameters..pinpointing dates by their level of appearance in the earth and other artifacts found near them is just as tenuous and far from accurate and the reasonm for the 99 percent consensus is just that none of them have a real clue so they set artificial points of agreement they canm all live with. They are all wrong if they don't follow the bibles words. IMO!Paul so, you think humans and dinosaurs coexisted together...? _________________________ Where ignorance is our master, there is no possibility of real peace. --Dalai Lama
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#195149 - 11/06/10 01:25 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: starlight.2]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	Yes and yes. MerryA and Starlight. The bible says Jesus is the word, MerryA and the bible is the word of God and yes it says so in the scriptures..simple as adding 2+2. I believe God created all life in 6 days so the dinosaurs would fall in that category This is what I will believe until God tells me otherwise. Before those six days it says the earth was dark and void and covered with water..kind of an environment that no kind of life could live in. Starlight you have to believe the bible to believe all life came in that 6 day period or you can believe the misunderstandings of mens science instead and you know where that leads to in eternity. Paul
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#195150 - 11/06/10 02:08 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Sorry, Paulwa, but your narrow anti-science view of things makes no sense to anyone unless they stick to the literal meaning of the word "day" in Genesis. Since the earth wasn't created until day 3 and the sun on day 4, thinking that the word "day" means 24 hours is just silly. It's unbelieveable how much dissention, disinformation, and outright hatred has been caused by that one word. _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195151 - 11/06/10 02:21 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ghoti]
shakey56 shakey56 Member Registered: 03/31/04 Posts: 1889 Loc: where the wild roadrunners roa...	Well Paul there may be some truth in your bible, but this part of it has been disproved in so many ways only complete fools still buy it literally. Edited by shakey56 (11/06/10 03:13 PM) _________________________ Against logic there is no armor like ignorance.
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#195152 - 11/06/10 03:12 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: shakey56]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	What a world!!!! Genesis:1:1: In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Genesis:1:2: And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. Genesis:1:3: And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. Genesis:1:4: And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. Genesis:1:5: And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day. 1Corinthians:14:33: For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints. Edited by ronniechoate34 (11/06/10 03:13 PM)
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#195155 - 11/06/10 06:34 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	All this horse manure over the way you interpret the word "day". Unbelieveable that this is the source of all the anti-science ignorance being perpetuated in our nation! No wonder we're falling behind the rest of the world in science education. Welcome to the new dark ages. _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195156 - 11/06/10 06:49 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ghoti]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	I think the dark ages start when mankind moves away from God.
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#195157 - 11/06/10 06:49 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ghoti]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	I think the dark ages start when mankind moves away from God.
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#195160 - 11/06/10 06:56 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ævory ævory Member Registered: 04/04/05 Posts: 9657	We're falling behind in our schools because of religion?
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#195161 - 11/06/10 07:20 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ævory]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	A big part of the dark ages was choosing to follow the Bible while rejecting science. Galileo was nearly put to death for saying the earth goes around the sun, since the theologeans of the time found some obscure Bible passage that implied the sun goes around the earth. These days in many places people would like to make it illegal to teach about evolution, all because of disagreement over the meaning of one word in the Bible. Without teaching about evolution, most of modern biology and all of Archaeology has to be thrown out the window. I agree with one thing Ronnie said - what a world. Edited by ghoti (11/06/10 07:22 PM) _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195162 - 11/06/10 07:37 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Dark ages such as the Crusades, or Holocaust, or even slavery in our early history maybe? That definitely had to be a moving away from God. _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195163 - 11/06/10 09:21 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	Right on Flicka and Ghoti early religious christian leaders were far from Godly examples and it was due to their idiocy that darkness prevailed and gave naysayers such as you have become to have something to grasp onto and beat the bible and religion in general to a pulp. Paul
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#195164 - 11/06/10 09:37 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Paulwa, the problem is that all those Christians back then who killed, persecuted, and enslaved people in the name of the Bible were just as sure they were right as you are. They held back advancements in science and improvement in life conditions for everyone by hundreds of years. When science has appeared to go against religion in the past, the religious leaders were always eventually proven to be wrong and science right. Don't you think there's a chance that might be the case again today with all the opposition to evolution? _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195165 - 11/06/10 10:24 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 ...and gave naysayers such as you have become to have something to grasp onto and beat the bible and religion in general to a pulp. In all honesty Paul, my pointing out the 'dark' times in our past is in defense of religion & the Bible. I am not as willing as you to give up on mankind and pray for the rapture. I still believe in mankind and believe we will move on from our current darkness just as those in the past have moved beyond their horrors. My acceptance & acknowledgement that such a thing as evolution (and ancient fossils) does/do exist is not a denouncement of the Bible or religion. It is reality and cannot be explained away. I can find this compatible with what is written in the Bible. It is not my problem that you cannot see that harmony. I see you as the naysayer if one of us must accept that label. _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195190 - 11/08/10 11:16 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ævory]
Deo Deo Member Registered: 02/11/08 Posts: 127	Originally Posted By: ævory We're falling behind in our schools because of religion? Interesting graph won't you say aevory. http://www.lasvegasgleaner.com/las_vegas...eform-ever.html Deo
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#195192 - 11/08/10 11:35 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Deo]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	I would say there's definitely a correlation between the spread of anti-evolution propaganda and decreasing scores in science. When you tell young people to reject the findings of science in favor of religion, you plant the seeds of a total rejection of science. That's dangerous to the long-term survival of our country, since the US has long been a world-wide leader in scientific advancement. Natural selection is at the core of nearly all advanced studies in biology, medicine, agriculture, and archaelogy, and we're breeding a new generation of students who may avoid those fields due to narrow religious convictions. _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195198 - 11/08/10 01:55 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
starlight.2 starlight.2 Member Registered: 02/19/09 Posts: 796	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 What a world!!!! Genesis:1:1: In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Genesis:1:2: And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. Genesis:1:3: And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. Genesis:1:4: And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. Genesis:1:5: And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day. 1Corinthians:14:33: For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints. so, do YOU think humans and dino's coexisted together? _________________________ Where ignorance is our master, there is no possibility of real peace. --Dalai Lama
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#195199 - 11/08/10 02:26 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: starlight.2]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Yes I do believe that dinosaurs existed alongside one another.
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#195200 - 11/08/10 02:45 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
Skylark Skylark Member Registered: 08/15/00 Posts: 17531 Loc: SoCal	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Yes I do believe that dinosaurs existed alongside one another. And the proof is that YOU are existing alongside us humans.
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#195201 - 11/08/10 05:03 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Skylark]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: Skylark Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Yes I do believe that dinosaurs existed alongside one another. And the proof is that YOU are existing alongside us humans. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195202 - 11/08/10 06:16 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Has anyone ever heard tell of a dragon?
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#195204 - 11/08/10 07:37 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Dinosaur is dead ringer for Potter dragon A new species discovered in the US has been named Dracorex hogwartsia, much to the delight of the author J. K. Rowling http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article724781.ece
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#195205 - 11/08/10 09:12 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	The 66 million-year-old dragon-like monster has been given the title Dracorex hogwartsia because it resembles the kind of fantastical creature encountered by the teenage wizard. I suppose you don't believe the age cited? _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195206 - 11/08/10 09:51 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Dragons and dinosaurs are the same thing. Are their accounts of people who have encountered dragons? Does the Bible mention dragons? The word dinosaur isn't a very old word. And please drop the sixty six million year old crapola. This thing can't be that old. In fact there's evidence that so called extinct dinosaurs may actually live among us. I agree with Paul. There are too many factors that make scientific dating methods extremely unreliable.
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#195207 - 11/08/10 10:28 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 And please drop the sixty six million year old crapola. It's from your link...the one you are using as proof of dinosaurs & man 'co-existing'. _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195208 - 11/09/10 12:23 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: flicka]
Paul I Paul I Member Registered: 02/24/00 Posts: 7913	Now there were with us seven brethren: and the first, when he had married a wife, deceased, and, having no issue, left his wife unto his brother: This from the Old Testament and affirmed in the New. So Paul and Ronnie, would you have done this if you encountered the same situation? (This is the word of the Lord) Layers of rock exist with most simple fossils at the bottom and most complex at the top. Since they supposedly all existed together why are they not found together? _________________________ "...only the shadow knows"
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#195210 - 11/09/10 07:11 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paul I]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	If men and dinosaurs co-existed, why is there no written or oral tradition of encounters with dinosaurs? When did dinosaurs die and why? If man was here, surely people would have noticed when dinosaurs weren't here anymore. Did they die before Noah's time or were they all on the ark? There is no mention of dinosaurs in the Bible or any literature I am aware of co-existence. If there is, would someone please give me a specific quote? ETA - I am not talking about the "sea monster" described in Job. Or the times Satan is described as a dragon. Edited by MerryA (11/09/10 07:35 AM) _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195211 - 11/09/10 07:34 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
ævory ævory Member Registered: 04/04/05 Posts: 9657	Originally Posted By: MerryA If men and dinosaurs co-existed, why is there no written or oral tradition of encounters with dinosaurs? When did dinosaurs die and why? If man was here, surely people would have noticed when dinosaurs weren't here anymore. Did they die before Noah's time or were they all on the ark? There is no mention of dinosaurs in the Bible or any literature I am aware of co-existence. If there is, would someone please give me a specific quote? Are Dinosaurs mentioned in the Bible? What must the handsome prince fight in his effort to save the princess? A dragon! What is one of the central symbols of eastern culture and found in every parade? A dragon! What animal do you find pictured in every Chinese food restaurant? A dragon! Prior to the discovery of dinosaur fossils in the 18th century, these creatures were referred to in many cultures as "dragons". Now we view dragons as mythical when in reality they are real cultural memories of dinosaurs now extinct. It would be very hard to believe that so many people from so many different places could have come up with such similar stories and similar descriptions if dragons never existed. According to ancient stories, dragons cam in many shapes and sizes. Some could fly, some could swim and they even laid eggs just like dinosaurs! The Bible mentions two dinosaurs by name and describes them in great detail. "Behemoth" (Job 40:15-24) and "Leviathan" (Job 41:1-34) From the description found in Job, scientists have attempted to identify these animals. They believe "Behemoth" is a Hippo and "Leviathan" is a Crocodile. But these scientists limited their choices to non-extinct species and did not consider the possibility of dinosaurs because man and dinosaur never coexisted. Oh really? Even in my own personal Bible a footnote suggests these two animals were a hippo and a crock! But there are some obvious reasons why this conclusion is wrong. First, "Behemoth" cannot be a Hippo because of Job 40:17 "He bends his tail like a cedar". A hippo has a short tail like a pig. Behemoth, had a large tail shaped like a cedar tree (large and tapered). I believe a better choice is that Behemoth is a Brachiosaurus type of large land dwelling dinosaur. It fits the description perfect. Second, "Leviathan" cannot be a Crocodile but is probably a Elasmosaurus type of large water-dwelling dinosaur. Here is what Job 41 says with my comments in brackets, "v9 you be laid low even at the sight of him? (This was a large animal) v10 No one is so fierce that he dares to arouse him; v25 When he raises himself up, the mighty fear; (crocs don't raise up at all but are always low) Because of the crashing they are bewildered. v26 (This animal was large! This animal made seismic thunder as it walked. You know...that slow, low, terrifying thud that Jurassic park portrayed so well.) v26 The sword that reaches him cannot avail; (crocs are quite easy to kill with a good spear) Nor the spear, the dart, or the javelin. (Croc wrestling is a sport, the croc usually looses) v31 He makes the depths boil like a pot; He makes the sea like a jar of ointment. v32 Behind him he makes a wake to shine; (crocs make little wake if any) v34 He looks on everything that is high" (again it was a tall animal with a long neck). What is significant about this is that if "Behemoth" and "Leviathan" are dinosaurs, then is it crystal clear that Job had either seen them personally, or there was a recent memory of them. This of course flies in the face of current evolutionary theory. The Paluxy River in Texas is the home of Dinosaur National Park with hundreds of fossil dinosaur tracks. Right beside the dinosaur tracks are three sets of human fossil footprints and a large cat track. The most famous track is the Taylor Trail which consists of a series of 14 footprints in a left-right pattern. The stride and foot length is consistent throughout. The evidence is so convincing that several university students recently presented with all the data accepted that the human footprints were real, but doubted the dinosaur footprints were real. All the fossil footprints in the Park are genuine. No informed person would ever suggest that the human footprints were carved as was irresponsibly rumored 50 years ago. It is clear that man and dinosaur live together and co-existed at the same time. With this both science and the Bible agree! So next time you order your favorite Chinese food dish, take a second look at the mural of the dragon on restaurant wall or on the take out container. Then go home an re-read Job 40-41! http://www.bible.ca/tracks/b-dinosaurs-mentioned-in-bible.htm http://WWW.BIBLE.CA
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#195212 - 11/09/10 07:52 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ævory]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Leviathan was not referenced in the Bible as a dinosaur - Leviathan, serpent and Satan are used interchangable. Most people understand Leviathan of Job 41 to be a whale. Both the behemoth and leviathan are given as examples in Job of evil that only God can overcome. Word Origin & History behemoth late 14c., huge biblical beast (Job xl.15), from L. behemoth , from Heb. b'hemoth, usually taken as plural of intensity of b'hemah "beast." But the Heb. word is perhaps a folk etymology of Egyptian pehemau , lit. "water-ox," the name for the hippopotamus. Online Etymology Dictionary, © 2010 Douglas Harper Bible Dictionary Behemoth definition (Job 40:15-24). Some have supposed this to be an Egyptian word meaning a "water-ox." The Revised Version has here in the margin "hippopotamus," which is probably the correct rendering of the word. The word occurs frequently in Scripture, but, except here, always as a common name, and translated "beast" or "cattle." http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/behemoth So we have the hippo and the whale - neither of which are dinosaurs. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195215 - 11/09/10 08:13 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ævory]
Deo Deo Member Registered: 02/11/08 Posts: 127	aevory you are assuming that dinosaur fossils were only discovered in the 18th century. Early people finding fossils assumed these creatures were still alive and featured them in their legends etc. Arthur Conan Doyle's The Lost World is a retelling of a similar story. At that time people thought that all creatures that god created were still alive and unchanged and that dinosaurs (which were discovered in the French Basin at that time) probably existed on some lost land like the tepuis in Venezuela. Deo
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#195216 - 11/09/10 08:16 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
Deo Deo Member Registered: 02/11/08 Posts: 127	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Dragons and dinosaurs are the same thing. Are their accounts of people who have encountered dragons? They encountered fossils Deo
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#195217 - 11/09/10 08:25 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Deo]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	There are several hundreds of thousands of stars and galaxies visible to us that are far more than 6000 light years away. That means the light we are seeing from them now that has been traveling for more than 6000 years to get here. How is that possible if the universe is only 6000 years old? _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195218 - 11/09/10 09:12 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ghoti]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Here are all the facts on exactly how we know the age of the earth from multiple methods, along with complete refutation of all the creationist arguments against them: http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-age-of-earth.html _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195220 - 11/09/10 12:26 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Originally Posted By: MerryA Leviathan was not referenced in the Bible as a dinosaur - Leviathan, serpent and Satan are used interchangable. Most people understand Leviathan of Job 41 to be a whale. Both the behemoth and leviathan are given as examples in Job of evil that only God can overcome. Word Origin & History behemoth late 14c., huge biblical beast (Job xl.15), from L. behemoth , from Heb. b'hemoth, usually taken as plural of intensity of b'hemah "beast." But the Heb. word is perhaps a folk etymology of Egyptian pehemau , lit. "water-ox," the name for the hippopotamus. Online Etymology Dictionary, © 2010 Douglas Harper Bible Dictionary Behemoth definition (Job 40:15-24). Some have supposed this to be an Egyptian word meaning a "water-ox." The Revised Version has here in the margin "hippopotamus," which is probably the correct rendering of the word. The word occurs frequently in Scripture, but, except here, always as a common name, and translated "beast" or "cattle." http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/behemoth So we have the hippo and the whale - neither of which are dinosaurs. MerryA, that's just what they want you to believe. When we walk in the darkness it's easy to be deceived. In the dark we've gotta go by our senses. But when we walk in the light we can penetrate the darkness and see what surrounds us. It makes it harder to be deceived.
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#195221 - 11/09/10 12:40 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ghoti]
Deo Deo Member Registered: 02/11/08 Posts: 127	Thank you aevory for bringing up the dinosaur/human track issue. It did not take long to do the research to find out those human tracks were actually dinosaur tracks. Deo
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#195222 - 11/09/10 12:41 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Deo]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Originally Posted By: Deo Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Dragons and dinosaurs are the same thing. Are their accounts of people who have encountered dragons? They encountered fossils Deo They encountered the living breathing thing. Jeremiah:51:34: Nebuchadrezzar the king of Babylon hath devoured me, he hath crushed me, he hath made me an empty vessel, he hath swallowed me up like a dragon, he hath filled his belly with my delicates, he hath cast me out. Were there any dinosaurs big enough to swallow a man whole? You bet there were.
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#195223 - 11/09/10 12:45 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
Deo Deo Member Registered: 02/11/08 Posts: 127	Ronnie, there are living breathing things which exist today which could swallow a man whole Deo
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#195224 - 11/09/10 01:17 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Deo]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	That's right. But where are the dragons? I think there may still be dragons among us today. In the jungles of central Africa countries of Congo, Cameroon, and Gabon are reports of animal an animal with a long neck, a long tail, and rounded shape tracks with three claws. The closest known animal that has these characteristics is a sauropod dinosaur. When some of the local people of the Likouala region would draw in the dirt or sand a representation of Mokele-mbembe they drew the shape of a sauropod dinosaur. Then when they were shown a picture of a sauropod dinosaur they said that picture is Mokele-mbembe. Mokele-mbembe means "One that stops the flow of rivers." French priest in the region called it "monstrous animal." Mokele-mbembe is also used as a generic term to refer to other animals like Emela-ntouka, Mbielu-mbielu-mbielu, and Nguma-monene. http://www.mokelembembe.com/ I doubt if they are trying to generate tourism to that particular place in Africa. Espescially considering the claims that this beast has overturned boats and kiled people. Edited by ronniechoate34 (11/09/10 01:17 PM)
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#195226 - 11/09/10 02:18 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Of the many fantasies in the thread, one that is striking to me is ronnie claiming that dragons and dinosaurs are the same. What about unicorns and fairies and the cyclops? An imaginary creature and a factual one. I love the King Aurthur legend as much as the next person - The Once and Future King is one of my favorites - but I know the difference between fiction and fact. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195227 - 11/09/10 02:39 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	MerryA you just think you know! And Ghoti the creation of the earth and the local universe were only 6000 years old the bible mentions stars and other heavenly phenomena that may have always existed so that light would take more than 6000 years to reach us. Lucifer walked amongst the stones of fire, could this have been eternal universes farout? No body knows the stuff you guys are throwing around as fact! Yes those beasts designated dino's may still have a few cousins living on the earth these days. Paul
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#195229 - 11/09/10 03:00 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	This documentary may help. I just found it and I've watched the first ten minutes of it. It is intesting. http://www.disclose.tv/action/viewvideo/47367/DRAGONS_OR_DINOSAURS_CREATION_OR_EVOLUTION_1_6/ Enjoy.
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#195232 - 11/09/10 05:21 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	I just love a good comedy fiction! _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195233 - 11/09/10 05:49 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 When we walk in the darkness it's easy to be deceived. In the dark we've gotta go by our senses. But when we walk in the light we can penetrate the darkness and see what surrounds us. It makes it harder to be deceived. Darkness does not cause us to be deceived, ignorance does. God said the light and the darkness were good. Folks like you tend to get confused because of the blinders you wear. I am not deceived. I am not wearing blinders. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195245 - 11/10/10 01:16 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	Jesus is the light of this world, the unsaved walk in darkness. the spiritual blind are in darkness. The unsaved will be cast into outer darkness for eternity. If God said the darkness was good it is only because He had a use for it. More MerryA ignorance of the truth or twisting it to make it fit her own views. Paul
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#195251 - 11/10/10 01:52 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Paulwa, you just can't hold yourself back from disrespecting the beliefs of others, can you? _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195259 - 11/10/10 04:55 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ghoti]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	It seems he gets especially upset with me - wonder why? Woman thing? No, he argues with flicka too. I don't believe like him? No, Steve you disagree with him more than I do. Must be I just piss him off more! _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195262 - 11/10/10 05:57 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	You guys are the head of disrespecting my belief. I could care less if you all worship the easter bunny or Pan as your god but if you spit out statements that put down the bible or weird views of the bible or the deity of Jesus Christ or the equatiing of God with allah or such, I will respond.If you don't like that then think before you speak. I will try to do likewise. Paul
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#195278 - 11/11/10 06:31 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Allah means God. Same God you and I pray to. Instead of making Islam out to be devil worship, why is it so hard for you to accept they believe a man who came after Jesus was the messenger of God? I am not Muslim and don't believe that but they do and that does not make them evil. As far as disrespecting your belief - you started it! _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195286 - 11/11/10 11:29 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
Deo Deo Member Registered: 02/11/08 Posts: 127	Paulwa why does it worry you where the unsaved like me will end up. You are not threatened by the unsaved, are you? Deo
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#195287 - 11/11/10 11:35 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
starlight.2 starlight.2 Member Registered: 02/19/09 Posts: 796	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Originally Posted By: Deo Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Dragons and dinosaurs are the same thing. Are their accounts of people who have encountered dragons? They encountered fossils Deo They encountered the living breathing thing. how can you be so sure? were you there? _________________________ Where ignorance is our master, there is no possibility of real peace. --Dalai Lama
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#195288 - 11/11/10 11:36 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: starlight.2]
sweetqt sweetqt Member Registered: 06/13/07 Posts: 709	I'll save ya Deo
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#195289 - 11/11/10 11:36 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: sweetqt]
sweetqt sweetqt Member Registered: 06/13/07 Posts: 709	I like your signature Starlight
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#195290 - 11/11/10 11:39 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: sweetqt]
starlight.2 starlight.2 Member Registered: 02/19/09 Posts: 796	Originally Posted By: sweetqt I like your signature Starlight thanks, sweet. _________________________ Where ignorance is our master, there is no possibility of real peace. --Dalai Lama
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#195292 - 11/11/10 11:46 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: starlight.2]
Deo Deo Member Registered: 02/11/08 Posts: 127	Thanks sweetqt. Deo
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#195293 - 11/11/10 11:55 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Deo]
sweetqt sweetqt Member Registered: 06/13/07 Posts: 709	Anytime, Deo I enjoy reading your posts.
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#195296 - 11/11/10 01:32 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: starlight.2]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Originally Posted By: starlight.2 Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Originally Posted By: Deo Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Dragons and dinosaurs are the same thing. Are their accounts of people who have encountered dragons? They encountered fossils Deo They encountered the living breathing thing. how can you be so sure? were you there? Were you?
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#195298 - 11/11/10 01:43 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	In your twisted view MerryA, allah may be the same god you worship but he is only a false god to me because the God of the bible does not remotely ressemble allah. You ,in my opinion are worshipping the equivalent of Baal of the old testament. Good thing God, Jehova, is merciful to all because if you worship allah he is very unforgiving and that is why so many Muslims are turning to the salvation of the Son of God who sacrificed Himself to save all who would accept His free gift. No Deo I am not feeling threatened by the unsaved only sad that they remain blind to the only salvation available to sinful man. Paul
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#195301 - 11/11/10 02:02 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	I'm just baffled by the simple things that people are missing. God is not complicated and He never intended to confuse us at all.
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#195304 - 11/11/10 02:16 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	I think God is the most complicated being in existance, but His plan of salvation is so simple a child can understand how to be saved. He knew how mankind would receive the good news of the gospel but He put it out there for everyone who would repent and turn to Him. I am sure He knew there would be some confusion in those who lean toward sin and not salvation. There is nothing that God does not know the answer too. Paul
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#195306 - 11/11/10 02:42 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 In your twisted view MerryA, allah may be the same god you worship but he is only a false god to me because the God of the bible does not remotely ressemble allah. It is not my view Paulwa, it is in the Bible. You need to read the Scriptures more and listen to FoxNews less. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195312 - 11/11/10 02:46 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Romans:1:20: For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, *even his eternal power and Godhead;* so that they are without excuse: Edited by ronniechoate34 (11/11/10 02:47 PM)
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#195321 - 11/11/10 03:09 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	It is not in the bible MerryA, Muhhamed changed the whole character of god in his writings.Thus allah is not the Bibles God. God in the bible says He never changes. allah did..end of story.
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#195323 - 11/11/10 03:13 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	God sure seems different between the Old and New Testaments. The God of the Old is all about anger, punishment, and vengefullness while in the New he's mostly about love and compassion. Seems like quite a change to me. _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195329 - 11/11/10 03:41 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 It is not in the bible MerryA, Muhhamed changed the whole character of god in his writings.Thus allah is not the Bibles God. God in the bible says He never changes. allah did..end of story. It is in the Bible. Genesis 17:18 And Abraham said to God, "Oh that Ishmael might live before You!" 19 But God said, "No, but Sarah your wife will bear you a son, and you shall call his name Isaac; and I will establish My covenant with him for an everlasting covenant for his descendants after him. 20 As for Ishmael, I have heard you; behold, I will bless him, and will make him fruitful and will multiply him exceedingly. He shall become the father of twelve princes, and I will make him a great nation. 21 But My covenant I will establish with Isaac, whom Sarah will bear to you at this season next year." Arabs are not covered by the Old Covenant but they pray to the same God - the same God that blessed Ishmael. Mohamed's visions and teachings created a new religion to praise God. Just as Jesus created a new religion to praise God. You may disagree with Islam's worship practices and may believe Muslims are going straight to hell but Allah (God) is the same God you and I pray to. God blessed Ishmael, made him fruitful, multiplied him exceedingly, made him the father of twelve princes, and made him a great nation. God created the Arab nations. God did not leave the Arab people and they did not leave Him. To claim otherwise is to call God a liar. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195330 - 11/11/10 03:42 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ghoti]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	That has caught many a eye, Ghoti but in the old testament God was preparing a line of people of His choice to lead the world to Himself and to discover mercy and love after generations of battle to just survive and remain a race of peoples. He went with them and aided them in their battles for survival and lands to propagate and live in. In time He sent Jesus His only begotten son to come to earth and sacrifice Himself for the salvation of mankind. He displayed Mercy and Love to man who had advanced in spiritual intelligence to appreciate those attributes of God. Godmade His first covenant with Israel and Jesus made the second covenant with the rest of mankind and all who would accept His sacrifice. So I think God revealed Himself in many ways to His people but at the finality He wanted man to know peace, love and mercy of forgiveness and to see that battle and death was not the best way to survive and live. allah does none of the latter things but only deals with punishment and no salvation for mankind. Paul
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#195331 - 11/11/10 03:47 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 allah does none of the latter things but only deals with punishment and no salvation for mankind. Paul Wrong - you really need to STOP listening to the lies of Glen Beck. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195333 - 11/11/10 03:55 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	Beck..maybe..Van Impe, Robertson, Jeffrey,Lindsey and tons of others including the Bible believe this to be true. Paul
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#195337 - 11/11/10 05:14 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	The Quran states that Allah made the heavens & the earth and created all things. Sound familar? _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195339 - 11/11/10 05:24 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	Paulwa, there are something like 38,000 diffeent Christian denominations world-wide, and what separates most of them are interpretations of different parts of the Bible. With that much ddisagreement even within the Christian community, how can you be so cetain your interpretations are correct? The obscure language that much of the Bible is written in leaves it wide open to multiple interpretations. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominations _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195340 - 11/11/10 05:38 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ævory ævory Member Registered: 04/04/05 Posts: 9657	Originally Posted By: Paulwa_dup1 It is not in the bible MerryA, Muhhamed changed the whole character of god in his writings.Thus allah is not the Bibles God. God in the bible says He never changes. allah did..end of story. Yes, I agree with you, Paulwa. It's my understanding, too.
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#195343 - 11/11/10 06:07 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ævory]
Paulwa_dup1 Paulwa_dup1 Member Registered: 02/12/05 Posts: 4951 Loc: Washington	Thanks Ronda,Ghoti we can dsagree all over the place so long as we accept the Gospel of Jesus Christ and turn our lives over to Him and try to follow His examples. There is lots of room for disagreement but not on the main points of salvation. Paul
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#195407 - 11/13/10 01:42 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: Paulwa_dup1]
ghoti ghoti Member Registered: 04/06/02 Posts: 8469 Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255	It's well understood that you hold that belief, Paulwa. Others just happen to respectfully disagree. Can't you just accept that? _________________________ Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
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#195411 - 11/13/10 02:22 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ghoti]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: ghoti It's well understood that you hold that belief, Paulwa. Others just happen to respectfully disagree. I do not "respectfully" disagree - he has told me too many times I am going to hell because I don't agree with him. What respect I had for him is long gone. He has made it clear he feels the same about me with all his name calling. As far as I'm concerned, he and ronnie are hate mongers who trash Islam and Catholicism every chance they get. My request to all the readers in www land - please do not take these two as representatives of accepted mainstream Christian doctrine. They are both blinded by ego and on the fanatical fringe. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195413 - 11/13/10 02:46 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Originally Posted By: MerryA Originally Posted By: ghoti It's well understood that you hold that belief, Paulwa. Others just happen to respectfully disagree. I do not "respectfully" disagree - he has told me too many times I am going to hell because I don't agree with him. What respect I had for him is long gone. He has made it clear he feels the same about me with all his name calling. As far as I'm concerned, he and ronnie are hate mongers who trash Islam and Catholicism every chance they get. My request to all the readers in www land - please do not take these two as representatives of accepted mainstream Christian doctrine. They are both blinded by ego and on the fanatical fringe. [img]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/pictureg...ek.html?image=2[/img] I couldn't post the image MerryA but there's a link. Please take a look for yourself at some of these pictures and see for yourself if the KKK and the Catholic church aren't a part of the same "outfit". The klan came about as for a reason ya' know. There was a reason for the hate speech and the devil was behind it all the while in order to promote his agenda. Things like civil wars and presidential assasinations don't just happen. They are orchestrated events and movements that are brought about by satanic forces. Possibly even the Jesuits.
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#195415 - 11/13/10 03:21 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
flicka flicka Member Registered: 04/06/00 Posts: 24616 Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 Possibly even the Jesuits. OMG! Not them! _________________________ "A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
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#195420 - 11/13/10 05:21 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 take a look for yourself at some of these pictures and see for yourself if the KKK and the Catholic church aren't a part of the same "outfit". You are not only full of hate but you don't know squat. The Klan's reason for wearing a hood is to hide their coward's face so they won't be caught murdering people. The La Paz wear the hood to symbolically tell people "don't look at me, I am nothing, look towards God." Holy Week is a big deal in Spain. They are polar opposites to the majority of the world. But to you, who loves to hate, you will stretch any percieved connection. Hey - Auburn is beating Georgia! _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195424 - 11/13/10 05:52 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
ronniechoate34 ronniechoate34 Member Registered: 02/06/10 Posts: 540 Loc: tennerida	Originally Posted By: MerryA Originally Posted By: ronniechoate34 take a look for yourself at some of these pictures and see for yourself if the KKK and the Catholic church aren't a part of the same "outfit". You are not only full of hate but you don't know squat. The Klan's reason for wearing a hood is to hide their coward's face so they won't be caught murdering people. The La Paz wear the hood to symbolically tell people "don't look at me, I am nothing, look towards God." Holy Week is a big deal in Spain. They are polar opposites to the majority of the world. But to you, who loves to hate, you will stretch any percieved connection. Hey - Auburn is beating Georgia! I know the devil's signature when i see it.
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#195429 - 11/13/10 09:46 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ronniechoate34]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	The devil did go down to Georgia - at least according to the song. _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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#195440 - 11/14/10 08:42 AM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: MerryA]
ævory ævory Member Registered: 04/04/05 Posts: 9657	Originally Posted By: MerryA You are not only full of hate but you don't know squat. The Klan's reason for wearing a hood is to hide their coward's face so they won't be caught murdering people. [/quote] Now go ask Ms. Ruth about that. Seamstress Works Hard Making Outfits for KKK By Boyce Watkins, PhD on Aug 16th 2010 11:03AM Filed under: News, Politics, Race and Civil RightsComments (14) Email This MotherJones.com recently caused a stir by publishing a photo essay about a woman named Ms. Ruth. The old woman spends up to 12 hours a day, five to seven days per week, putting together outfits for members of the Ku Klux Klan. She blesses each outfit after its done and uses the money to take care of her 40-year-old handicapped daughter. The story about Ms. Ruth is certainly interesting in that it appears that she is not necessarily a bad person. She simply believes in the KKK and thinks that what the organization does is good for America. Obviously, she lives on the side of ignorance, but the story is interesting primarily because it shows a side of the KKK that is usually closed off to the general public. Personally, I found myself thinking, "So THAT'S where they get their robes made!" It's not as if they pick them up in the Aryan Nation section of the local Wal-Mart. The story about Ms. Ruth might also be interpreted as a reflection of how hate continues to exist in America. Our country has made significant progress since the civil rights movement, but there is much work left to be done. Organizations like the Southern Christian Leadership Conference, the NAACP, the National Action Network, the Rainbow Push Coalition and others will continue to be needed in America for at least another 100 years. One other interesting side effect of the story about Ms. Ruth and the KKK is that it shows the humanity of those who've been stung by the pain of learning to hate another human being for no reason. Most of the time, when we are angry toward others, there is an underlying cause of that anger. The same way the schoolyard bully was probably abused by a parent, many of those who carry this kind of anger feel that they are actually an underdog defending their territory. Some whites, especially those who worship the words of men like Glenn Beck and Bill O'Reilly, feel a strong sense of entitlement, which leads them to believe that the country they own is being taken over by others. Of course, they are wrong, since America belongs to no one. But the racism we see in corporate America, academia and other institutions is typically driven by those who expect that their way of doing things is the only way to do them. What's also interesting is that while some of us wish to demonize Fox News viewers for being the only self-righteous, divisive people in America, this is clearly not the case. I receive e-mails on a regular basis from African Americans who have views that are just as tainted and mean-spirited as members of the KKK. These opinions might involve immigrants or any group that is different from our own, and sometimes they carry the same venom I hear from members of the klan. Fighting for your people is one thing, but fighting for true equality is another. Many of us never figure out the difference. Dr. Boyce Watkins is the founder of the Your Black World Coalition and a Scholarship in Action resident of the Institute for Black Public Policy.
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#195446 - 11/14/10 01:59 PM Re: Well He Couldn't Have Been Too Smart in His Person [Re: ævory]
MerryA MerryA Member Registered: 01/10/04 Posts: 10887 Loc: Tennessee	Originally Posted By: ævory The story about Ms. Ruth might also be interpreted as a reflection of how hate continues to exist in America. Hate continues to exist in America through folks like Ms. Ruth. Edited by MerryA (11/14/10 01:59 PM) _________________________ "I was curious. Since I'm not a cat, that's not dangerous." - Greg House 76.22.172.94
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