#189430 - 07/17/10 12:06 PM
Question here...
|
ævory
Member
Registered: 04/04/05
Posts: 9657
|
Which of the posts in the last 24 hours or so would you guys like to see challenged...the most. Or were they just blowing off some steam or attitude postings...i can't really tell.  Plus, maybe you don't see them as challenge-able. never know. I mean, wow...youse really went to town there and just thinking about responding to em all, it is an exhausting thought. Yeah, Dayvd would be great to have around...but, really, he's better off gone. ha!
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189431 - 07/17/10 12:06 PM
Re: Question here...
[Re: ævory]
|
ævory
Member
Registered: 04/04/05
Posts: 9657
|
oh, and since i dont' claim to be all wise, i meant this for anyone's reference to, cus i may not answer or be able to.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189438 - 07/17/10 01:37 PM
Re: Question here...
[Re: ævory]
|
flicka
Member
Registered: 04/06/00
Posts: 24616
Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142
|
I'm not sure what you mean?
_________________________
"A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189465 - 07/18/10 12:37 AM
Re: Question here...
[Re: flicka]
|
ghoti
Member
Registered: 04/06/02
Posts: 8469
Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255
|
Challenge any and all that you like, Ronda. Most folks are more than willing to explain their positions if you ask.
_________________________
Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189468 - 07/18/10 06:38 AM
Re: Question here...
[Re: flicka]
|
Lola
Member
Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 5944
|
I'm not sure what you mean?
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189469 - 07/18/10 10:13 AM
Re: Question here...
[Re: Lola]
|
ghoti
Member
Registered: 04/06/02
Posts: 8469
Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255
|
Dayvd was (and presumably still is) very opposed to the pre-trib rapture also, and pretty much in agreement with Flicka's position in that regard. He and I had a very in-depth discussion about it way back in the very early days of PQ (2004).
If you take the time to read it I think you'll find that we covered the topic pretty thoroughly from all the angles. I hate to cross-post, but here's the link:
http://www.powerquad.net/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=33
If anyone sees any flaws in our analysis or would like to comment, feel free to have at it.
_________________________
Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189472 - 07/18/10 11:05 AM
Re: Question here...
[Re: ghoti]
|
ghoti
Member
Registered: 04/06/02
Posts: 8469
Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255
|
Also, Ronda, in another thread you commented that we would have to know the minds of all Christians to know how they feel about the pre-trib rapture. I disagree.
The official doctrine of the Catholic church is opposed to the pre-trib concept. Since Catholics are BY FAR the largest Christian denomination in the world, that pretty much settles the issue right there.
Evangelicals and some Southern Baptist groups here in the US may fervently embrace the pre-trib theory, and books like the "Left Behind" series have given it recent publicity, but outside the US it doesn't get much play. South America, for example, is nearly 100% Catholic and I doubt many are pre-trib followers there.
ETA: My wife is Catholic, and I've often attended sevices with her over the last 15 or so years so have some direct experience. In all that time with her church I have NEVER heard any mention of rapture.
Edited by ghoti (07/18/10 11:16 AM)
_________________________
Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189481 - 07/18/10 04:15 PM
Re: Question here...
[Re: ghoti]
|
Paulwa_dup1
Member
Registered: 02/12/05
Posts: 4951
Loc: Washington
|
Jack Van Impe is friends with the Pope and says the Pope believes in the pre trib rapture. Last I heard.
Paul
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189487 - 07/18/10 05:32 PM
Re: Question here...
[Re: Paulwa_dup1]
|
flicka
Member
Registered: 04/06/00
Posts: 24616
Loc: SLO County, CA - 66.122.77.142
|
What’s the Catholic Position?
As far as the millennium goes, we tend to agree with Augustine and, derivatively, with the amillennialists. The Catholic position has thus historically been "amillennial" (as has been the majority Christian position in general, including that of the Protestant Reformers), though Catholics do not typically use this term. The Church has rejected the premillennial position, sometimes called "millenarianism" (see the Catechism of the Catholic Church 676). In the 1940s the Holy Office judged that premillennialism "cannot safely be taught," though the Church has not dogmatically defined this issue.
With respect to the rapture, Catholics certainly believe that the event of our gathering together to be with Christ will take place, though they do not generally use the word "rapture" to refer to this event (somewhat ironically, since the term "rapture" is derived from the text of the Latin Vulgate of 1 Thess. 4:17—"we will be caught up," [Latin: rapiemur]).
catholic library
(Jack Van Impe is a false prophet)
Edited by flicka (07/18/10 05:33 PM)
_________________________
"A lot of things were acceptable--until we stopped accepting it." -- Al Sharpton '12
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189490 - 07/18/10 06:22 PM
Re: Question here...
[Re: flicka]
|
ghoti
Member
Registered: 04/06/02
Posts: 8469
Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255
|
someone is obviously spreading lies about the Pope. Here is a question someone asked on the "Ask a Catholic" website:
it has come to my attention that the Pope recently has stated in the Oservatore Romano [the Vatican newspaper] he believes in the Rapture and agrees with Protestants.
And here is the answer:
The Pope certainly cannot have said anything heretical in the area. He can't change the Church's position.
For this, you need only go to Catechism of the Catholic Church. It simply states that we believe that Christ will return again at the "Resurrection of the Dead". It says nothing about the Church being raptured out of the world 7 years to the end, or 3.5 years prior or whatever the latest variation of dispensationlist heresy being promoted by televangelists is.
This whole idea is less than 200 years old. It is a position no one in Church history ever took. It is rooted in a complete misreading of the Scriptures.
Yes, those who are alive at the time of Christ's return will be "raptured" or "transformed in the twinkling of an eye", but that happens at the end of time.
Nor will there be a literal millennium (1,000 years) after which there is another battle between good and evil. When He comes back next time, it's over. There will be a New Heaven and New Earth.
That is not just the latest Teaching of the Church, it has been the constant Teaching of the Church.
http://www.askacatholic.com/_webpostings...nTheRapture.cfm
CATHOLICS (INCLUDING THE POPE) DO NOT BELIEVE IN THE PRE-TRIB DOCTRINE UNLESS THEY HAVE DECIDED TO BE IN VIOLATION OF CHURCH DOCTRINE!! CASE CLOSED.
_________________________
Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189492 - 07/18/10 06:42 PM
Re: Question here...
[Re: ghoti]
|
ghoti
Member
Registered: 04/06/02
Posts: 8469
Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255
|
So Ronda, are "Y'all" satisfied now, or do you have some facts to present that prove differently?
_________________________
Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189502 - 07/18/10 09:50 PM
Re: Question here...
[Re: ghoti]
|
Paulwa_dup1
Member
Registered: 02/12/05
Posts: 4951
Loc: Washington
|
You guys are going to be mortified when you see that the pre trib's are right. And we are you know sand will soon prove it I think.
Don't think JVImpe is a false profit either but he is getting kind of out of date with his style of ministering to the people.
Paul
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189505 - 07/18/10 10:58 PM
Re: Question here...
[Re: Paulwa_dup1]
|
ghoti
Member
Registered: 04/06/02
Posts: 8469
Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255
|
The people who've just shrugged their shoulders, did the best they could in life, and didn't spend any time worrying about when or if Jesus was coming back have been the real winners over the last 2000 years. They didn't waste any time or money waiting and hoping for something that may not happen for thousands of more years - if ever.
Jesus even said it himself - no one, not even him, knows when he would return. IMO it's rather arrogant and even a touch blasphemous to pretend to know more about it than he did.
_________________________
Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189506 - 07/18/10 11:29 PM
Re: Question here...
[Re: ghoti]
|
ghoti
Member
Registered: 04/06/02
Posts: 8469
Loc: Ishpeming, MI 75.128.229.255
|
BTW, Jack has made MANY predictions over the years that haven't come true. If that doesn't make him a false prophet, then I don't know what does.
Look at how much hypocrisy, lying, and cheating has been exposed within big-time ministries and churches just in the last few yars. Here's a clue - if a minister or religious spokesperson or organization lives a life of luxury and/or is constantly asking people for money then you'd better be damned suspicious of their real motives.
_________________________
Feisty survivors populate this site. Avoid controversies unless you have a very thick skin.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#189515 - 07/19/10 12:24 PM
Re: Question here...
[Re: ghoti]
|
Deo
Member
Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 127
|
Being an athiest, it is so liberating not having to contend with contend with theology and its "prophets and preachers"
Deo
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
|
